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Replies

  • fishingcomicfishingcomic Senior Member Posts: 24,234 Senior Member
    No because corporations are not people.
    'I've spoken of the Shining City all my political life. …In my mind it was a tall, proud city built on rocks stronger than oceans, windswept, God-blessed, and teeming with people of all kinds living in harmony and peace; a city with free ports that hummed with commerce and creativity. And if there had to be city walls, the walls had doors and the doors were open to anyone with the will and the heart to get here. That's how I saw it, and see it still.'" Ronald Reagan
  • JulietJuliet Posts: 0
    So, if I'm a strict Catholic and I have 50 employees working for my company, I have to pay for the morning after pill?
    Why is that exactly?

    How about if Joe and I ran a partnership and we had 50 employees?
  • JulietJuliet Posts: 0
    Sandra Fluke is running for Congress in California. I guess she knows a winning issue when she sees one.
  • fishingcomicfishingcomic Senior Member Posts: 24,234 Senior Member
    Steven wrote: »
    So, if I'm a strict Catholic and I have 50 employees working for my company, I have to pay for the morning after pill?
    Why is that exactly?

    How about if Joe and I ran a partnership and we had 50 employees?

    So I lose my freedom of religion because I work for a Catholic? Nobody is paying for morning after pills, they are paying for insurance that as part of the many things they offer, offer morning after pills. Next you will say they shouldn't give them money because they might use it for morning after pills.

    Should I be able to say because I am a member of Opus Dei, I don't have to hire any Jews or as a member of a Mormon cult I don't have to hire blacks, because I still believe they are evil? Or maybe I should avoid hiring women because they might want an abortion.
    'I've spoken of the Shining City all my political life. …In my mind it was a tall, proud city built on rocks stronger than oceans, windswept, God-blessed, and teeming with people of all kinds living in harmony and peace; a city with free ports that hummed with commerce and creativity. And if there had to be city walls, the walls had doors and the doors were open to anyone with the will and the heart to get here. That's how I saw it, and see it still.'" Ronald Reagan
  • JulietJuliet Posts: 0
    So I lose my freedom of religion because I work for a Catholic?

    By not paying for the morning after pill for you, you're employer is taking away your religious freedom? Really?

    The problem with your examples is whether I'm imposing my religious beliefs on you. If I don't hire Blacks (if I'm Mormon) Jews (Opus Dei) or Gays (Arizonans), I'm imposing my religious beliefs on those groups. By not buying the Pill for my employees, am I imposing my religious beliefs on them? Is this the only way they can get contraceptives?
  • fishingcomicfishingcomic Senior Member Posts: 24,234 Senior Member
    Yes really. I have a right to purchase anything I want with the salary and benefits you provide, provide said purchase is legal. Salary and benefits are fungible. You are not handing out morning after pills in my paycheck.

    And again corporations are not people and they have no rights.
    'I've spoken of the Shining City all my political life. …In my mind it was a tall, proud city built on rocks stronger than oceans, windswept, God-blessed, and teeming with people of all kinds living in harmony and peace; a city with free ports that hummed with commerce and creativity. And if there had to be city walls, the walls had doors and the doors were open to anyone with the will and the heart to get here. That's how I saw it, and see it still.'" Ronald Reagan
  • JulietJuliet Posts: 0
    Yes really. I have a right to purchase anything I want with the salary and benefits you provide, provide said purchase is legal. Salary and benefits are fungible. You are not handing out morning after pills in my paycheck.

    And again corporations are not people and they have no rights.

    First, Corporations are persons and have rights. Thus sayeth the Supreme Court. Just like the ACA is the law of the land - despite being wholly unconstitutional.
    Second, salary isn't fungible with benefits since I pay you directly but have to pay a third party or, if I self insure, pay for them myself. That argument doesn't wash.
  • HextallHextall Senior Member Posts: 9,520 Senior Member
    This thread is a morning after pill.

    [high five?]
  • NZ IndicatorNZ Indicator Senior Member Posts: 10,157 Senior Member
    Plan A, Plan B or Plan C?

    Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 2
  • JulietJuliet Posts: 0
    Hextall wrote: »
    This thread is a morning after pill.

    [high five?]

    [/fist pump]
  • ricinusricinus Senior Member Posts: 6,214 Senior Member
    Hextall wrote: »
    This thread is a morning after pill.

    [high five?]

    [/face palm]

    Mike
    My new goal in life is to become an Alter Kaker...
  • ouzelproouzelpro Senior Member Posts: 5,361 Senior Member
    This thread convinces me that Catholics are not to be trusted. Stinkin' Papists, they are. (Irish accent)
  • GoldenladleGoldenladle Super Moderator Posts: 3,898 Senior Member
    How about if you as a business owner with religious concerns, didn't provide insurance and gave your employees enough of a raise so they can purchase their own insurance. That way you aren't offended by Betty who isn't the same religion or Sue who is an atheist that uses birth control.

    Would that work?

    Moved to Montana, gonna be a dental floss tycoon.

  • swizzswizz Senior Member Posts: 2,560 Senior Member
    Corporations are not people, they are subhuman mongrels
    All of your Trout are belong to me.
  • BuffcoBuffco Senior Member Posts: 10,552 Senior Member
    sherb wrote: »
    sandra fluke is running for congress in california. I guess she knows a winning issue when she sees one.

    War on women!!!
  • JulietJuliet Posts: 0
    Buffco wrote: »
    War on women!!!

    indeed.

    pakistanigirl_blog_main_horizontal.jpg
  • HextallHextall Senior Member Posts: 9,520 Senior Member
    She drives a Ford.
  • fishingcomicfishingcomic Senior Member Posts: 24,234 Senior Member
    Steven wrote: »
    First, Corporations are persons and have rights. Thus sayeth the Supreme Court.

    Then we should be able to throw them in prison.

    The argument that you are being forced to buy birth control doesn't wash. You are being obligated to buy insurance and insurance is being forced to provide basic women's health services. So basically you are arguing that you do not have to provide insurance. Totally different issue. Again corporations do not have all rights and obligations as individuals. You have said so yourself.
    'I've spoken of the Shining City all my political life. …In my mind it was a tall, proud city built on rocks stronger than oceans, windswept, God-blessed, and teeming with people of all kinds living in harmony and peace; a city with free ports that hummed with commerce and creativity. And if there had to be city walls, the walls had doors and the doors were open to anyone with the will and the heart to get here. That's how I saw it, and see it still.'" Ronald Reagan
  • fishingcomicfishingcomic Senior Member Posts: 24,234 Senior Member
    How about if you as a business owner with religious concerns, didn't provide insurance and gave your employees enough of a raise so they can purchase their own insurance. That way you aren't offended by Betty who isn't the same religion or Sue who is an atheist that uses birth control.

    Would that work?

    See this is why I believe we should remove all mandates. No individual mandate, no business mandate, and no mandate hospitals treat people that do not have insurance. You provide a public option, expand medicaid so that anyone can afford insurance and if people do not have insurance, they die.
    'I've spoken of the Shining City all my political life. …In my mind it was a tall, proud city built on rocks stronger than oceans, windswept, God-blessed, and teeming with people of all kinds living in harmony and peace; a city with free ports that hummed with commerce and creativity. And if there had to be city walls, the walls had doors and the doors were open to anyone with the will and the heart to get here. That's how I saw it, and see it still.'" Ronald Reagan
  • dryfliedryflie Senior Member Posts: 1,442 Senior Member
    “The modern conservative is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness.” - John Kenneth Galbraith
  • jbillyjbilly Senior Member Posts: 5,288 Senior Member
  • JulietJuliet Posts: 0
    How about if you as a business owner with religious concerns, didn't provide insurance and gave your employees enough of a raise so they can purchase their own insurance. That way you aren't offended by Betty who isn't the same religion or Sue who is an atheist that uses birth control.

    Would that work?

    Not under the current rules as the corporation would have to pay the penalty.
  • JulietJuliet Posts: 0
    Then we should be able to throw them in prison.

    The argument that you are being forced to buy birth control doesn't wash. You are being obligated to buy insurance and insurance is being forced to provide basic women's health services.

    Nope.

    I am being forced to buy a product that provides something against my religious beliefs (hypothetically, of course). Or, I self insure (which most large companies do), in which case I'm actually paying for the pill.
  • JulietJuliet Posts: 0
    dryflie wrote: »
    Only if they are churches.

    Well, apparently not even the Obama Administration agrees with this as certain non-profit corporations are exempt.
  • NZ IndicatorNZ Indicator Senior Member Posts: 10,157 Senior Member
    No individual mandate, no business mandate, .

    The way it's going the mandates may never be followed anyway.

    The latest March 31 deadline has now been rolled back again.
  • GoldenladleGoldenladle Super Moderator Posts: 3,898 Senior Member
    Steven wrote: »
    Not under the current rules as the corporation would have to pay the penalty.

    Maybe the rules will change...

    Moved to Montana, gonna be a dental floss tycoon.

  • swizzswizz Senior Member Posts: 2,560 Senior Member
    joekrz wrote: »

    The latest March 31 deadline has now been rolled back again.
    Laughing hard.
    There may be no end to them rolling it back until they see some numbers that work. They're gonna have to work harder at selling this crap and fudging the numbers purty soon or..... ??
    American public (especially youth) is a bit smarter now than they had anticipated. Thank you interwebs and information era.
    All of your Trout are belong to me.
  • NZ IndicatorNZ Indicator Senior Member Posts: 10,157 Senior Member
    Electoral disaster mitigation has been the goal since O-care was passed. Keep moving the goal posts because the dems aren't adult enough to admit how flawed it is. The word "deadline" apparently has a different meaning than I thought.

    On the plus side this gives my wife more time to sell policies since the insurance companies off the exchange have decided to follow the same enrollment period times available on the exchange.

    Outside of the enrollment period all you can buy are short term policies unless you have a qualifying event between whenever the new deadline is and November 15.



    Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 2
  • fishingcomicfishingcomic Senior Member Posts: 24,234 Senior Member
    'I've spoken of the Shining City all my political life. …In my mind it was a tall, proud city built on rocks stronger than oceans, windswept, God-blessed, and teeming with people of all kinds living in harmony and peace; a city with free ports that hummed with commerce and creativity. And if there had to be city walls, the walls had doors and the doors were open to anyone with the will and the heart to get here. That's how I saw it, and see it still.'" Ronald Reagan
  • swizzswizz Senior Member Posts: 2,560 Senior Member
    I think they're last gasp to get people to enroll will be to make the penalties ridiculously high. Now that they're in your wallet may as well dig deeper. It'll be interesting to see how We The People react to that on a large scale, taxation is already off the charts. How hard will the gov push and money-grub before people freak out and revolt in some form? That'll be the future of Obamacare, fairly obvious. They will have to do something radical to get everyone to swallow it.... or junk it already.
    All of your Trout are belong to me.

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