Why is it?

That nobody here is screaming for GM blood?
«13

Replies

  • NZ IndicatorNZ Indicator Senior Member Posts: 10,023 Senior Member
    Steven wrote: »
    That nobody here is screaming for GM blood?

    Because they feel GM deserved a bailout?

    Pretty sad they get out of any liability for dead people due their faulty cars because of the bankruptcy.

    I haven't touched a GM product since 1994. They made junk then and they still make junk now.
  • fishingcomicfishingcomic Senior Member Posts: 23,714 Senior Member
    Was there anybody screaming for Toyota blood?
    'I've spoken of the Shining City all my political life. …In my mind it was a tall, proud city built on rocks stronger than oceans, windswept, God-blessed, and teeming with people of all kinds living in harmony and peace; a city with free ports that hummed with commerce and creativity. And if there had to be city walls, the walls had doors and the doors were open to anyone with the will and the heart to get here. That's how I saw it, and see it still.'" Ronald Reagan
  • NZ IndicatorNZ Indicator Senior Member Posts: 10,023 Senior Member
    Was there anybody screaming for Toyota blood?

    No need to. The accusations on the accelerator issue were proven false. Do a google search on it. There were numerous tests run on the accelerator system that came up with nothing wrong.

    That and Toyota never asked for a bailout with our tax dollars.
  • fishingcomicfishingcomic Senior Member Posts: 23,714 Senior Member
    So why did Toyota settle?

    The irony of you accusing me of not doing research here is hilarious.

    http://www.forbes.com/fdc/welcome_mjx.shtml
    'I've spoken of the Shining City all my political life. …In my mind it was a tall, proud city built on rocks stronger than oceans, windswept, God-blessed, and teeming with people of all kinds living in harmony and peace; a city with free ports that hummed with commerce and creativity. And if there had to be city walls, the walls had doors and the doors were open to anyone with the will and the heart to get here. That's how I saw it, and see it still.'" Ronald Reagan
  • NZ IndicatorNZ Indicator Senior Member Posts: 10,023 Senior Member
    Corporations settle all the time to get the monkey off their back.

    The link you provided doesn't have anything regarding what is being discussed. ????

    I don't have time right now, but I'll search for the test data and post it if I can find it.
  • Scott ButnerScott Butner Senior Member Posts: 3,918 Senior Member
    joekrz wrote: »
    Corporations settle all the time to get the monkey off their back.

    The link you provided doesn't have anything regarding what is being discussed. ????

    I don't have time right now, but I'll search for the test data and post it if I can find it.

    "Toyota says in the settlement that it misled Americans by making deceptive statements about the safety problems that caused its vehicles to speed up uncontrollably, a stark admission for a company that has built its brand on safety and reliability."

    http://www.washingtonpost.com/business/economy/toyota-reaches-12-billion-settlement-to-end-criminal-probe/2014/03/19/5738a3c4-af69-11e3-9627-c65021d6d572_story.html
  • fishingcomicfishingcomic Senior Member Posts: 23,714 Senior Member
    Yeah the link I provided had the same info Scott. Thanks.
    'I've spoken of the Shining City all my political life. …In my mind it was a tall, proud city built on rocks stronger than oceans, windswept, God-blessed, and teeming with people of all kinds living in harmony and peace; a city with free ports that hummed with commerce and creativity. And if there had to be city walls, the walls had doors and the doors were open to anyone with the will and the heart to get here. That's how I saw it, and see it still.'" Ronald Reagan
  • fishingcomicfishingcomic Senior Member Posts: 23,714 Senior Member
    joekrz wrote: »
    Corporations settle all the time to get the monkey off their back.

    The link you provided doesn't have anything regarding what is being discussed. ????

    I don't have time right now, but I'll search for the test data and post it if I can find it.

    Yes $1.2 billion is nuisance money.
    'I've spoken of the Shining City all my political life. …In my mind it was a tall, proud city built on rocks stronger than oceans, windswept, God-blessed, and teeming with people of all kinds living in harmony and peace; a city with free ports that hummed with commerce and creativity. And if there had to be city walls, the walls had doors and the doors were open to anyone with the will and the heart to get here. That's how I saw it, and see it still.'" Ronald Reagan
  • ricinusricinus Senior Member Posts: 6,214 Senior Member
    joekrz wrote: »
    Because they feel GM deserved a bailout?

    Pretty sad they get out of any liability for dead people due their faulty cars because of the bankruptcy.

    I haven't touched a GM product since 1994. They made junk then and they still make junk now.

    Why do you hate America??;)

    Mike
    My new goal in life is to become an Alter Kaker...
  • dryfliedryflie Senior Member Posts: 1,442 Senior Member
    Simple. Because we've grown accustomed to many (not all) companies producing defective products and lying about it when caught. Not saying it's acceptable just a fact of life. Trust me though it does hurt their business at least in the short run.
    “The modern conservative is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness.” - John Kenneth Galbraith
  • JulietJuliet Posts: 0
    Was there anybody screaming for Toyota blood?

    In 2009, you guys were too busy screaming for Lloyd Blankfein's blood.

    FWIW, $1.2 billion is a little more than 5% of one year's worth of Toyota's earnings. That's nuisance money.
    Also, Toyota's been co-operating with the government since 2009, the allegations that it pled to were basically for initially misleading the government, and Joe's partly right -
    the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration never found defects in electronics or software in Toyota cars, which had been targeted as a possible cause.

    GM's been killing people for 10+ years and covered it up. Where are the stones and pitchforks?
  • fishingcomicfishingcomic Senior Member Posts: 23,714 Senior Member
    What I think is funny is that somehow the fact that someone got a bail-out, which they are paying back, means they should be somehow devoid of flaw. Also let's not forget that so many were willing to blame the union for GM's problems when this is yet further evidence that the people who are truly overpaid at GM and many other companies are in management.
    'I've spoken of the Shining City all my political life. …In my mind it was a tall, proud city built on rocks stronger than oceans, windswept, God-blessed, and teeming with people of all kinds living in harmony and peace; a city with free ports that hummed with commerce and creativity. And if there had to be city walls, the walls had doors and the doors were open to anyone with the will and the heart to get here. That's how I saw it, and see it still.'" Ronald Reagan
  • fishingcomicfishingcomic Senior Member Posts: 23,714 Senior Member
    Steven wrote: »
    In 2009, you guys were too busy screaming for Lloyd Blankfein's blood.

    Oh I wasn't sure, thanks. The fact is people do not get that bent out shape here over product liability claims. I think you want ralphnaderforums.com for that.

    Wait so increasing payroll for line employees by 5% is a tremendous burden on the shareholder yet $1.2 billion is pennies. Remind me that I do not want you to manage my money.
    'I've spoken of the Shining City all my political life. …In my mind it was a tall, proud city built on rocks stronger than oceans, windswept, God-blessed, and teeming with people of all kinds living in harmony and peace; a city with free ports that hummed with commerce and creativity. And if there had to be city walls, the walls had doors and the doors were open to anyone with the will and the heart to get here. That's how I saw it, and see it still.'" Ronald Reagan
  • JulietJuliet Posts: 0
    Well one has to wonder where the Wrath of Obama is since this was basically hidden from him.

    Hell, Jamie Dimon never killed anybody...if only he had a union I guess.
  • NZ IndicatorNZ Indicator Senior Member Posts: 10,023 Senior Member
    Was there anybody screaming for Toyota blood?

    As I mentioned there was no need to.

    http://www.nhtsa.gov/UA
    The profit that Toyota makes...the settlement they paid out is a drop in the bucket. They did it to settle and move on. Not because their was actually something seriously wrong with their cars.

    Lawyers smelling blood and all you know.


    What did they find? As it turns out, the NASA investigation pointed to the same culprits as both Toyota and the Department of Transportation. Instances of unintended acceleration were caused by sticky pedals, floor mat interference, or good old-fashioned pedal misapplicaton.

    http://www.autoblog.com/2011/02/15/report-toyota-image-gets-big-boost-after-nasa-findings-revealed/
  • JulietJuliet Posts: 0
    Oh I wasn't sure, thanks. The fact is people do not get that bent out shape here over product liability claims. I think you want ralphnaderforums.com for that.

    Wait so increasing payroll for line employees by 5% is a tremendous burden on the shareholder yet $1.2 billion is pennies. Remind me that I do not want you to manage my money.

    Uh, there's a fail. Assuming Ford North America looks like Toyota North America in terms of wages (50% of sales) and pre-tax profit margin (4%), 5% of profits is 0.2% of revenues. A 5% increase in wages would be 2.5% of revenues or 63% of profits. And of course, the settlement is a one-time thing (like your love life). The wage increase is forever (like that sore on your lip.).

    Let's be honest. You'd be lucky to have me.
  • NZ IndicatorNZ Indicator Senior Member Posts: 10,023 Senior Member
    ricinus wrote: »
    Why do you hate America??;)

    Mike

    Lol...I don't hate America. I just hate hate the American car companies and the crap they produce.

    Ironically my Toyota was made in Indiana and the Nissan was made in Mississipi... Some of the "American" brands you will buy are made in Mexico with parts shipped in from China.
  • fishingcomicfishingcomic Senior Member Posts: 23,714 Senior Member
    Steven wrote: »
    Uh, there's a fail. Assuming Ford North America looks like Toyota North America in terms of wages (50% of sales) and pre-tax profit margin (4%), 5% of profits is 0.2% of revenues. A 5% increase in wages would be 2.5% of revenues or 63% of profits. And of course, the settlement is a one-time thing (like your love life). The wage increase is forever (like that sore on your lip.).

    Let's be honest. You'd be lucky to have me.

    Not if you are willing to throw away $1.2 billion you do not have to.
    'I've spoken of the Shining City all my political life. …In my mind it was a tall, proud city built on rocks stronger than oceans, windswept, God-blessed, and teeming with people of all kinds living in harmony and peace; a city with free ports that hummed with commerce and creativity. And if there had to be city walls, the walls had doors and the doors were open to anyone with the will and the heart to get here. That's how I saw it, and see it still.'" Ronald Reagan
  • fishingcomicfishingcomic Senior Member Posts: 23,714 Senior Member
    joekrz wrote: »
    As I mentioned there was no need to.

    http://www.nhtsa.gov/UA
    The profit that Toyota makes...the settlement they paid out is a drop in the bucket. They did it to settle and move on. Not because their was actually something seriously wrong with their cars.

    Lawyers smelling blood and all you know.


    What did they find? As it turns out, the NASA investigation pointed to the same culprits as both Toyota and the Department of Transportation. Instances of unintended acceleration were caused by sticky pedals, floor mat interference, or good old-fashioned pedal misapplicaton.



    http://www.autoblog.com/2011/02/15/report-toyota-image-gets-big-boost-after-nasa-findings-revealed/

    Right and that is why as part of the settlement they admitted to wrong doing. And btw GM is probably no more guilty than Toyota.

    So you think that people were just lying about their accelerators being stuck?

    From your link.
    Through analysis and investigations, NHTSA identified two types of vehicle-based mechanical defects as causes of UA. Those were related to pedal entrapment and "sticky pedal." At the urging of NHTSA, Toyota has already recalled more than seven million vehicles because those defects could result in UA.
    'I've spoken of the Shining City all my political life. …In my mind it was a tall, proud city built on rocks stronger than oceans, windswept, God-blessed, and teeming with people of all kinds living in harmony and peace; a city with free ports that hummed with commerce and creativity. And if there had to be city walls, the walls had doors and the doors were open to anyone with the will and the heart to get here. That's how I saw it, and see it still.'" Ronald Reagan
  • JulietJuliet Posts: 0
    Not if you are willing to throw away $1.2 billion you do not have to.

    Remind me not to hire you as a CEO. You can't fight city hall and you're not going to win with the G. As much in resources as Toyota has to fight, it can't compete with the U.S. government. Somebody at Toyota figured that the $1.2 billion was cheaper than fighting (even if they won).
  • fishingcomicfishingcomic Senior Member Posts: 23,714 Senior Member
    I don't care if the recall is for electronics or not. A defect is a defect.
    'I've spoken of the Shining City all my political life. …In my mind it was a tall, proud city built on rocks stronger than oceans, windswept, God-blessed, and teeming with people of all kinds living in harmony and peace; a city with free ports that hummed with commerce and creativity. And if there had to be city walls, the walls had doors and the doors were open to anyone with the will and the heart to get here. That's how I saw it, and see it still.'" Ronald Reagan
  • fishingcomicfishingcomic Senior Member Posts: 23,714 Senior Member
    Steven wrote: »
    Remind me not to hire you as a CEO. You can't fight city hall and you're not going to win with the G. As much in resources as Toyota has to fight, it can't compete with the U.S. government. Somebody at Toyota figured that the $1.2 billion was cheaper than fighting (even if they won).

    So you're saying that it would cost more than $1.2 billion to fight it. Not to mention the damage to Toyota's reputation. Right. Maybe I am not the one who shouldn't be CEO.

    Perhaps someone at Toyota realized they ****ed up and that they better pay now because there is no way they could win.
    'I've spoken of the Shining City all my political life. …In my mind it was a tall, proud city built on rocks stronger than oceans, windswept, God-blessed, and teeming with people of all kinds living in harmony and peace; a city with free ports that hummed with commerce and creativity. And if there had to be city walls, the walls had doors and the doors were open to anyone with the will and the heart to get here. That's how I saw it, and see it still.'" Ronald Reagan
  • JulietJuliet Posts: 0
    So you're saying that it would cost more than $1.2 billion to fight it. Not to mention the damage to Toyota's reputation. Right. Maybe I am not the one who shouldn't be CEO.

    Perhaps someone at Toyota realized they ****ed up and that they better pay now because there is no way they could win.

    What do you think the damage to Toyota's reputation would be if they fought on for years and years? Undoubtedly, the chances of losing and what that could costs plays into it.
  • fishingcomicfishingcomic Senior Member Posts: 23,714 Senior Member
    If they fought and won it would be outstanding. So they were pretty sure they would lose. Makes a pretty big statement considering the burden of proof was on the government. This is nothing to poo poo.
    'I've spoken of the Shining City all my political life. …In my mind it was a tall, proud city built on rocks stronger than oceans, windswept, God-blessed, and teeming with people of all kinds living in harmony and peace; a city with free ports that hummed with commerce and creativity. And if there had to be city walls, the walls had doors and the doors were open to anyone with the will and the heart to get here. That's how I saw it, and see it still.'" Ronald Reagan
  • JulietJuliet Posts: 0
    If they fought and fought and fought...and fought some more, and won. Maybe not so much. If nobody apparently cares if they settled, why would anybody care if they won?
  • fishingcomicfishingcomic Senior Member Posts: 23,714 Senior Member
    Stop you already lost.
    'I've spoken of the Shining City all my political life. …In my mind it was a tall, proud city built on rocks stronger than oceans, windswept, God-blessed, and teeming with people of all kinds living in harmony and peace; a city with free ports that hummed with commerce and creativity. And if there had to be city walls, the walls had doors and the doors were open to anyone with the will and the heart to get here. That's how I saw it, and see it still.'" Ronald Reagan
  • NZ IndicatorNZ Indicator Senior Member Posts: 10,023 Senior Member
    So you're saying that it would cost more than $1.2 billion to fight it. Not to mention the damage to Toyota's reputation.

    In the long run, negative publicity would cost more than the $1.2 B settlement they agreed to and fighting the government.

    The fight has been going on for close to 4 years. Settle and move on and people don't care anymore. Out of sight, out of mind.

    That's just standard procedure in business in case you didn't know.

    The only difference here is that the "new GM" isn't liable any more for problem cars pre-2009 due to the bankruptcy filing. Thats a crock of **** if you ask me.
  • JulietJuliet Posts: 0
    Stop you already lost.

    You ARE a comic. I most certainly didn't "lose" your minimum wage detour.
    And the initial point was never addressed. Nobody here cares because GM is a "good" company (e.g. unionized).
  • ricinusricinus Senior Member Posts: 6,214 Senior Member
    Declaring bankruptcy and walking away from your obligations is a well used business tactic...

    Mike
    My new goal in life is to become an Alter Kaker...
  • JulietJuliet Posts: 0
    ricinus wrote: »
    Declaring bankruptcy and walking away from your obligations is a well used business tactic...

    Mike

    Yes. But legal has little to do with outrage.

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