So, does anybody still...

EdBEdB Senior MemberPosts: 2,933 Senior Member
....think there was only one shooter who murdered Kennedy?
«1

Replies

  • ricinusricinus Senior Member Posts: 6,214 Senior Member
    More to the point, who was behind it??

    Mike
    My new goal in life is to become an Alter Kaker...
  • EdBEdB Senior Member Posts: 2,933 Senior Member
    I don't know, was it the CIA, the Mafia, LBJ, or all of the above?
  • Shawn C.Shawn C. Senior Member Posts: 6,960 Senior Member
    I used to think there were multiple shooters. From what I understand Oswald must have been one hell of a marksman to pull it off; to the point where many find it almost impossible.
    However, the older I get I really don't believe in many conspiracy theories. If the mob, LBJ, CIA, etc was behind the assasination, wouldn't somebody credible have broken the silence in the intervening years?
    Occums Razor, I suppose.
  • NZ IndicatorNZ Indicator Senior Member Posts: 10,115 Senior Member
    Shawn C. wrote: »
    If the mob, LBJ, CIA, etc was behind the assasination, wouldn't somebody credible have broken the silence in the intervening years?

    Thats what Jimmy Hoffa thought.
  • creekguycreekguy Senior Member Posts: 3,905 Senior Member
    I've been watching a 2 hour special on the different theories on the History Channel. (yeah, I know, but it seems pretty honestly done). It does seem to depend on the interpretation of the bullet hit as it hits the president's head. Some responsible people say its quite likely the head would recoil quickly back to the source. Hard to believe, but maybe. They also point out that magic bullet modelers misplace John Connelly in the Limo. He is actually sitting to the left where they model him. And in the direct line of the bullet. Why it has taken 50 years to find this out I don't know, but conspiracy books sell better. If those things are true, the evidence of conspiracy becomes much weaker. I do think Oswald was involved.
  • HextallHextall Senior Member Posts: 9,520 Senior Member
    A theory I heard about today was that the shot that took off Kennedys head was an accidental shot from a secret service agent that w in the car behind the limo.

    Lots of pieces fall into place for this theory.
  • WetdogWetdog Senior Member Posts: 5,149 Senior Member
    If Kennedy had not had on his back brace he may have lived. The first shot was through the throat. That should have sent him down but the brace prevented it making it possible for the two other shots. And no, it is all on Oswald. Anyone which still thinks otherwise has not grasped reality.
    I find the assault on free thought disturbing,
    I find the willingness to give it up frightening.
  • jbillyjbilly Senior Member Posts: 5,258 Senior Member
    It was done with at least 2 drones
  • George KGeorge K Super Moderator Posts: 9,971 Senior Member
    Wetdog wrote: »
    If Kennedy had not had on his back brace he may have lived. The first shot was through the throat. That should have sent him down but the brace prevented it making it possible for the two other shots. And no, it is all on Oswald. Anyone which still thinks otherwise has not grasped reality.

    +1

    OTOH, perhaps it was space aliens pissed off because we were dissecting their buddies at Area 51.

    Hmmm, or perhaps Oswald was a shape-shifting alien, pissed off when he discovered his Energy Credits wouldn't work on Earth.
    Keep your stinkin' government hands off my Medicare.
  • swizzswizz Senior Member Posts: 2,559 Senior Member
    Mooninites did it.... pissed because he had the audacity to land there.
    Mooninites_zps81b122ba.jpg
    All of your Trout are belong to me.
  • EdBEdB Senior Member Posts: 2,933 Senior Member
    I don't believe the ridiculous government theory that Oswald was the lone shooter. I see there are still some that do.
  • swizzswizz Senior Member Posts: 2,559 Senior Member
    Here's my conspiracy theory.
    It's been a week-long news media blitz celebration of JFK... a patriotic mass distraction of the real news: Obamacare initiation epic fail, no immediate solution, Americans very pissed.
    All of your Trout are belong to me.
  • jbillyjbilly Senior Member Posts: 5,258 Senior Member
    swizz wrote: »
    Here's my conspiracy theory.
    It's been a week-long news media blitz celebration of JFK... a patriotic mass distraction of the real news: Obamacare initiation epic fail, no immediate solution, Americans very pissed.

    Oh great now the drones have been dispatched above Swizz's log cabin.
  • jbillyjbilly Senior Member Posts: 5,258 Senior Member
    EdB wrote: »
    I don't believe the ridiculous government theory that Oswald was the lone shooter. I see there are still some that do.

    He was the lone gunman using a laser designator. He was not a real shooter.
  • dryfliedryflie Senior Member Posts: 1,442 Senior Member
    EdB wrote: »
    I don't believe the ridiculous government theory that Oswald was the lone shooter. I see there are still some that do.

    Not a big surprise Ed. However all the available evidence says there were three shots fired. Found on the floor of the book depository (within minutes of the shooting) was one rifle (purchased by Oswald) and three spent shells. Believe what you want but let's see some actually proof if you and other conspiracy nuts want to convince others.
    “The modern conservative is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness.” - John Kenneth Galbraith
  • EdBEdB Senior Member Posts: 2,933 Senior Member
    No, I'll leave it to you government conspiracy nuts to believe what you want to believe.
  • jbillyjbilly Senior Member Posts: 5,258 Senior Member
    EdB wrote: »
    No, I'll leave it to you government conspiracy nuts to believe what you want to believe.

    There will never be a post on this board that can top this!
  • EdBEdB Senior Member Posts: 2,933 Senior Member
    By the way, a majority of the American people think there was a conspiracy of more than one shooter.

    http://www.infowars.com/jfk-assassination-majority-of-americans-are-conspiracy-theorists/

    Nov 21, 2013

    Several polls released this week to mark the 50th anniversary of the assassination of president John F. Kennedy reveal that the majority of Americans still do not believe that Lee Harvey Oswald was the lone assassin, and that there was a wider conspiracy that was covered up.

    In a Rasmussen poll, only 36 percent of Americans surveyed said that they believe Kennedy was targeted by a lone gunman on this day, November 22, in 1963.

    The survey found that just as many, 37 percent, believe JFK was murdered in a larger plot involving other actors. Another large portion of respondents, 27 percent, said they are not sure, emphasizing the mystery that still surrounds the fateful event.

    The Rasmussen poll also revealed that those who were alive at the time of the shooting are more likely to believe in a conspiracy than younger respondents, indicating that the questioning of the official story as described by The Warren Commission may be waning as generations pass.

    In a new Washington Post-ABC News poll, a large majority of 62 percent believe that Oswald did not act alone, with only 29 percent buying the official line.
  • dryfliedryflie Senior Member Posts: 1,442 Senior Member
    EdB wrote: »
    No, I'll leave it to you government conspiracy nuts to believe what you want to believe.

    What I choose to believe is evidence and facts, not fantastic theories. We have a mentally challenged person, pro-cuban and therefore anti Kennedy, works in the book depository, owns a rifle purchased via mail order for $12. We have witnesses on the site point to the building window where a rifle was seen. Gun found at the site with 3 spent shells. Oswald leaves work and later shoots a Dallas cop, arrested with a hand gun tied to the cop shooting. Those are the facts as I know them, what do you have to refute them?? Give us all the benefit of your investigative efforts.

    Now if you wish to argue Oswald may have been influenced by the CIA, or the Mob or Martians that's fine, just provide some proof. Thousands of people have a thousand theories but little proof. Do you believe all the possibilities or just your own (whatever that might be)?
    “The modern conservative is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness.” - John Kenneth Galbraith
  • EdBEdB Senior Member Posts: 2,933 Senior Member
    There are over forty witnesses that said they saw or heard shots from the grassy knoll.

    http://22november1963.org.uk/jfk-assassination-grassy-knoll-witnesses

    A number of professional snipers tried to duplicate the three shots in the time recorded on radios and could not do it.

    Howard Hunt's death bed confession that LBJ was involved in the murder.

    The secret service guards were told to stand down before the murder. Normally there would have been two agents standing on the rear bumper blocking the shots from the rear. they were called off.

    The Zapruder film shows the third shot coming from the front.

    The Katzenback memo saying the government should cover up the assassination by saying Oswald was the lone shooter.

    The magic bullet found in the hospital was unmarked and could not have shot two people as theorized by the government.
  • creekguycreekguy Senior Member Posts: 3,905 Senior Member
    The psychologists say that when we experience a terrible shock, we have a hard time accepting that it happened by chance or was committed by a single deranged person, even if the evidence is clear. A similar effect happens for events like Pearl Harbor, where people can't accept that simple incompetence might be to blame.

    BTW, the same polls that document public belief in a conspiracy also show these people are very limited in their actual knowledge of the event, and believe a lot of discredited "facts" as well.
  • EdBEdB Senior Member Posts: 2,933 Senior Member
    It's interesting how people dismiss theories that disagree with the government version of what happened. There have been many government conspiracies that people swallow without question, such as the cold war theory that the Russians and Chinese were trying to take over the world, and McCarthy's conspiracy theory that the commies were in our schools, in the movie industry, in the military, they were everywhere.

    The government conspiracy theory that Iraq had WMD and was conspiring with Al Qaida, and was involved in 9/11, all BS that the American people swallowed without question until the facts proved them wrong. But about 30% still believe that anybody who thinks there is a conspiracy that questions the official government koolaid is some kind of nut.
  • jbillyjbilly Senior Member Posts: 5,258 Senior Member
    Why didn't Oswald destroy the book depository with thermite to cover his tracks?
  • George KGeorge K Super Moderator Posts: 9,971 Senior Member
    EdB wrote: »
    There are over forty witnesses that said they saw or heard shots from the grassy knoll.

    http://22november1963.org.uk/jfk-assassination-grassy-knoll-witnesses

    A number of professional snipers tried to duplicate the three shots in the time recorded on radios and could not do it.

    Howard Hunt's death bed confession that LBJ was involved in the murder.

    The secret service guards were told to stand down before the murder. Normally there would have been two agents standing on the rear bumper blocking the shots from the rear. they were called off.

    The Zapruder film shows the third shot coming from the front.

    The Katzenback memo saying the government should cover up the assassination by saying Oswald was the lone shooter.

    The magic bullet found in the hospital was unmarked and could not have shot two people as theorized by the government.

    Ed, Ed, Ed................ Where to begin?

    Let's start with the Katzenback memo. You have it backwards. It does not say the truth must be covered up, but rather that the numerous false conspiracy theories and untrue stories about the assassination must be demonstrated to be false. Read it in full.

    Moving right along to Howard Hunt's so-called "death bed confession" - actually a series of chats with his son over time. Hunt was a congenital liar with a mile-deep grudge against the USG. Your own UK source notes that he planted fake memos in the National Archives to incriminate JFK in the assassination of Ngô Đình Diệm.

    Your other "evidence" is equally faulty. Let's look at just one more issue, the conflicting witness statements about where the gunshots came from. As a Marine you certainly should have heard a lot of gunfire, enough to know that directionality is difficult to pinpoint under any circumstances and especially in a boxed-in area with many reflecting surfaces and irregular terrain. It's no surprise that those standing near the knoll placed the shots as coming from the book warehouse, and those in front of the warehouse said they came from the knoll.

    Keep up the good work, Ed.
    Keep your stinkin' government hands off my Medicare.
  • EdBEdB Senior Member Posts: 2,933 Senior Member
    Oswald shot full metal jackets out of the Carcano rifle, the bullet that exploded Kennedy's head was a hollow point.

    What's your government version of that George?

    The autopsy report was destroyed along with the pictures of the head wound.

    John Kerry and Kathleen Kennedy both say there was more than one shooter.
  • dryfliedryflie Senior Member Posts: 1,442 Senior Member
    EdB wrote: »
    It's interesting how people dismiss theories that disagree with the government version of what happened. There have been many government conspiracies that people swallow without question, such as the cold war theory that the Russians and Chinese were trying to take over the world, and McCarthy's conspiracy theory that the commies were in our schools, in the movie industry, in the military, they were everywhere.

    The government conspiracy theory that Iraq had WMD and was conspiring with Al Qaida, and was involved in 9/11, all BS that the American people swallowed without question until the facts proved them wrong. But about 30% still believe that anybody who thinks there is a conspiracy that questions the official government koolaid is some kind of nut.

    Ed. You know or should know that there are vast differences between Government lies (Iraq and WMD for example) and so called secret conspiracies. Governments lie for political reasons all the time, all governments. Most intelligent people distrust governments and most of us living in the 50-60's did not truly believe the Russians or Chinese were trying to take over the world. But we did have an honest fear that playing chicken could lead to nuclear disaster. Don't misunderstand reasonable fear for accepting nutty theories. We did not however own a bomb shelter although millions did. At the same time unreasonable fear can lead to lots of strange behavior as in the case of McCarthy's accusations.

    My real question for you and others is this. What is the real value believing in and promoting 50 year old unproven conspiracy theories about a long dead president. Why is it even an issue to occupy your thoughts 50 years later. What earthly value does your concern have today?? Perhaps only to justify your belief in every whacky theory out there....if one is right well they must all be....is that it.

    I do want to point out one fact. The claim that Oswald committed the crime wasn't a "government theory" it was the conclusion reached by the Dallas police department within hours or short days of the event. Now if you really believe the entire Dallas police force was compromised and lying when the entire world was watching their every move (amazing how much access they provided the media) then my friend you'll believe anything.
    “The modern conservative is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness.” - John Kenneth Galbraith
  • EdBEdB Senior Member Posts: 2,933 Senior Member
    As you say, governments lie all the time. Why do you choose to believe that the government is not lying about the Kennedy assassination?

    If you recall, I said that I would let you believers in the government version believe what you want to rather than try to go through it all again, but you challenged me to back up my stance on the issue, so I did. Now I am quite content to move on and not rehash it again. I'll end it be saying that the preponderance of evidence says that there was more than one shooter of Kennedy, IMO.
  • jbillyjbilly Senior Member Posts: 5,258 Senior Member
    dryflie wrote: »
    I do want to point out one fact. The claim that Oswald committed the crime wasn't a "government theory" it was the conclusion reached by the Dallas police department within hours or short days of the event. Now if you really believe the entire Dallas police force was compromised and lying when the entire world was watching their every move (amazing how much access they provided the media) then my friend you'll believe anything.

    LBJ was a Texan...the fix was in...enough said. ;)
  • jbillyjbilly Senior Member Posts: 5,258 Senior Member
    EdB wrote: »
    The magic bullet found in the hospital was unmarked and could not have shot two people as theorized by the government.

    This was because it had been loaded with thermite instead of black powder...that $hit is way better than magic.
  • dryfliedryflie Senior Member Posts: 1,442 Senior Member
    EdB wrote: »
    As you say, governments lie all the time. Why do you choose to believe that the government is not lying about the Kennedy assassination?

    If you recall, I said that I would let you believers in the government version believe what you want to rather than try to go through it all again, but you challenged me to back up my stance on the issue, so I did. Now I am quite content to move on and not rehash it again. I'll end it be saying that the preponderance of evidence says that there was more than one shooter of Kennedy, IMO.

    Because it wasn't the "Government" who made the determination about Oswald being the only shooter, it was the Dallas police force. Their investigation disproved the grassy knoll shooter, no evidence was found to support it. They found Oswald and their evidence tied him to the shooting.

    Really Ed....what the hell difference does it make 50 years later if one guy killed Kennedy, if 20 guys killed him or if the Easter bunny killed him.
    “The modern conservative is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness.” - John Kenneth Galbraith

Leave a Comment

BoldItalicStrikethroughOrdered listUnordered list
Emoji
Image
Align leftAlign centerAlign rightToggle HTML viewToggle full pageToggle lights
Drop image/file
Magazine Cover

GET THE MAGAZINE Subscribe & Save

Temporary Price Reduction.

SUBSCRIBE NOW

Give a Gift   |   Subscriber Services

PREVIEW THIS MONTH'S ISSUE

GET THE NEWSLETTER Join the List and Never Miss a Thing.

Get the top Fly Fisherman stories delivered right to your inbox.