Forced? By whom? The answer is probably no. Should the anme be changed? Absolutely. Keeping it is trading short term gains for long term problems. Sports team loyalty is entirely manufactured in any event, meaning a name change is a cost but accompanied by some pretty spectacular opportunities (imagine all the new merchandising, as well as fake "vintage" merchandising).
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GoldenladleSuper ModeratorPosts: 3,866Senior Member
The "R-word" controversy has erupted again. Should Dan Snyder be forced to change the name?
Let me ask you this if the name of the team was the New Jersey N****rs do you think they should be forced to change it.
'I've spoken of the Shining City all my political life. …In my mind it was a tall, proud city built on rocks stronger than oceans, windswept, God-blessed, and teeming with people of all kinds living in harmony and peace; a city with free ports that hummed with commerce and creativity. And if there had to be city walls, the walls had doors and the doors were open to anyone with the will and the heart to get here. That's how I saw it, and see it still.'" Ronald Reagan
'I've spoken of the Shining City all my political life. …In my mind it was a tall, proud city built on rocks stronger than oceans, windswept, God-blessed, and teeming with people of all kinds living in harmony and peace; a city with free ports that hummed with commerce and creativity. And if there had to be city walls, the walls had doors and the doors were open to anyone with the will and the heart to get here. That's how I saw it, and see it still.'" Ronald Reagan
It is about the most offensive thing you can call a native-American. Very different than Braves or Seminoles.
'I've spoken of the Shining City all my political life. …In my mind it was a tall, proud city built on rocks stronger than oceans, windswept, God-blessed, and teeming with people of all kinds living in harmony and peace; a city with free ports that hummed with commerce and creativity. And if there had to be city walls, the walls had doors and the doors were open to anyone with the will and the heart to get here. That's how I saw it, and see it still.'" Ronald Reagan
I am not taking it up with any one person. I have thought since Stanford changed their name to Cardinals that if any team should change their name it is Washington. Trust me if they were the Baltimore Beaners, somebody would have **** that name away by now.
'I've spoken of the Shining City all my political life. …In my mind it was a tall, proud city built on rocks stronger than oceans, windswept, God-blessed, and teeming with people of all kinds living in harmony and peace; a city with free ports that hummed with commerce and creativity. And if there had to be city walls, the walls had doors and the doors were open to anyone with the will and the heart to get here. That's how I saw it, and see it still.'" Ronald Reagan
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GoldenladleSuper ModeratorPosts: 3,866Senior Member
10 Congressmen published an open letter calling for Snyder to change it, which started the latest hoo-haw.
I take it that these congressmen had complaints from their constituency? Frankly, I really don't care what they call themselves. I don't recollect ever having heard any Native American complain about the name just like had never heard any native American complain about North Dakota's hockey team either.
Not my fight. Maybe they should call themselves the Washington Fillibusters.
In 2009 the Supreme Court of the United States handed down a ruling that ended a 17 year battle between the NFL Washington Redskins organization and Native American activists. The activists were arguing the Washington Redskins football team name as being so offensive that they should not receive trademark protection. The American trademark law states that a name being used cannot "disparage . . . persons, living or dead, . . . or bring them into contemp, or disrepute."
The Washington team had the "****" name since 1933. They were federal trademarks on the name in 1967. That same year a group of Native American activists challenged this and in 1970, the Trademark Trial and Appeal Board ruled that the name could be looked at as being offensive to Native Americans. The Washington franchise appealed that ruling and the issue worked its way back and forth through the legal system until it finally reached the Supreme Court in 2009. The Washington **** franchise won this battle due to the "legal theory of laches - the plantiffs waited too long to commence their lawsuit to ban the trademark." The Supreme Court did not rule on the basis of racism and would not comment further.
'I've spoken of the Shining City all my political life. …In my mind it was a tall, proud city built on rocks stronger than oceans, windswept, God-blessed, and teeming with people of all kinds living in harmony and peace; a city with free ports that hummed with commerce and creativity. And if there had to be city walls, the walls had doors and the doors were open to anyone with the will and the heart to get here. That's how I saw it, and see it still.'" Ronald Reagan
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fishingcomicSenior MemberPosts: 23,442Senior Member
You've been waiting since 1972? And it's Cardinal, the color, not Cardinals, the bird.
I have no dog in this fight. Just interested in another thread that could go over 6 posts.
I don't see how that is relevant. They changed it from Indians and yes since 1972 I have thought the name of the team should be changed. It helps that I am a Giants fan, but still.
'I've spoken of the Shining City all my political life. …In my mind it was a tall, proud city built on rocks stronger than oceans, windswept, God-blessed, and teeming with people of all kinds living in harmony and peace; a city with free ports that hummed with commerce and creativity. And if there had to be city walls, the walls had doors and the doors were open to anyone with the will and the heart to get here. That's how I saw it, and see it still.'" Ronald Reagan
I take it that these congressmen had complaints from their constituency? Frankly, I really don't care what they call themselves. I don't recollect ever having heard any Native American complain about the name just like had never heard any native American complain about North Dakota's hockey team either.
Not my fight. Maybe they should call themselves the Washington Fillibusters.
Sent from my HTC One X
Some of the Congressmen in question are members of the Native American Caucus, and they themselves are offended. I remember hearing about these complaints before.
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GoldenladleSuper ModeratorPosts: 3,866Senior Member
Some of the Congressmen in question are members of the Native American Caucus, and they themselves are offended. I remember hearing about these complaints before.
I guess my dislike of professional football is showing. I didn't hear it probably because I didn't want to. Thanks though.
I don't see how that is relevant. They changed it from Indians and yes since 1972 I have thought the name of the team should be changed. It helps that I am a Giants fan, but still.
Being as you're a native NYer, I would have thought that the St. John's Red Men would have been high on the list.
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fishingcomicSenior MemberPosts: 23,442Senior Member
All my family are Syracuse fans. I really do not follow college athletics. The only reason why I know about Stanford was we moved to Palo Alto right after the name change and went to a game where many fans did not like the name change. BTW I don't know what it is like now, but in 1972 that stadium sucked. You still sat on wooden benches.
'I've spoken of the Shining City all my political life. …In my mind it was a tall, proud city built on rocks stronger than oceans, windswept, God-blessed, and teeming with people of all kinds living in harmony and peace; a city with free ports that hummed with commerce and creativity. And if there had to be city walls, the walls had doors and the doors were open to anyone with the will and the heart to get here. That's how I saw it, and see it still.'" Ronald Reagan
Syracuse wasn't immune to insulting native American's either (my family is also SU fans): they had a native american mascot until 1975 (Big Chief Bill Orange).
Re: Redskins... change the name already. It's clearly an offensive slur for native americans.
U of I won't change from the Illini, but did lose the kid doing the war dance as Chief Illiniwak.
The Blackhawks are named after a person, Chief Blackhawk of the Sauk tribe. The team does take heat every once in awhile for the Indian face it uses as its logo. No way they'll change it in any of our lifetimes: Best logo in sports.
U of I won't change from the Illini, but did lose the kid doing the war dance as Chief Illiniwak.
The Blackhawks are named after a person, Chief Blackhawk of the Sauk tribe. The team does take heat every once in awhile for the Indian face it uses as its logo. No way they'll change it in any of our lifetimes: Best logo in sports.
Yea I see nothing offensive about using an actual tribal name. **** and to a lesser extent Chiefs are slurs. Of all of them though IMO **** is the worst.
'I've spoken of the Shining City all my political life. …In my mind it was a tall, proud city built on rocks stronger than oceans, windswept, God-blessed, and teeming with people of all kinds living in harmony and peace; a city with free ports that hummed with commerce and creativity. And if there had to be city walls, the walls had doors and the doors were open to anyone with the will and the heart to get here. That's how I saw it, and see it still.'" Ronald Reagan
The team does take heat every once in awhile for the Indian face it uses as its logo. No way they'll change it in any of our lifetimes: Best logo in sports.
Congrats to the Blackhawks on a great game and series win! I think our teams may see each other in the near future!
As to the "Best logo in sports.," it is hard to argue with the 'Hawks or the Redwings. NBA logos generally suck. Baseball doesn't have a ton of long-standing logos per se because most uni's sport a simple script of the mascot or city. Football? Some great ones there with some nice history as well.
In general, newer teams logos and colors are are pretty lame. Either the colors or the logo itself are too trendy. For example, take the Houston Texans; great colors and a stupid, slanted bull caricature.
And to James I say this: If you think sports loyalty is manufactured then you obviously you were not raised in a sports town. While the games themselves are important and a lot of fun, there is a huge amount of civic pride at stake that no jersey manufacturer or marketing exec in Bristol, CT can sway.
I'm with Comic, it should go -- it's stupid and offensive and completely outdated. No honor to the Native American, reference/eithet/perjorative dates from when the only good Indian was a dead one, and if you haven't heard of the controversy before you've not been listening.
Congrats to the Blackhawks on a great game and series win! I think our teams may see each other in the near future!
i was going to call you on this the moment you typed it, but figured i'd let reality slap you in the face first
pitt was a good regular season team......and beneficiary of playing a young islander team and a decent but dinged up ottawa team......easy draw
they are not built for playoff hockey.....their D is mediocre at best, and neither goalie is starter quality
the bruins are better in all 3 zones in the playoffs......they cycle and grind in the zone better, they don't turn the puck over, and both their forwards and defensemen can actually play D.....Letang is an offensive defenseman for sure.....but it is a joke that he's a Norris finalist
i always wondered why the name wasn't changed, but in some ways it's nice to see some stubbornness (though I don't necessarily agree) in the face of political correctness...especially after Marquette changed their name from the "Warriors" to "The Golden Eagles.....omg how stupid is that.....the only warriors were native Americans?!?!? If you ask me the word warrior is a positive, not a negative. It's not killers, butchers, or the murdering rapists.
I find the assault on free thought disturbing,
I find the willingness to give it up frightening.
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Replies
Crooow:This music would work better with women in bikinis shaking all over the place. I guess that's true of any music really.
Who's complaining? Native Americans? The media? Liberals, Conservatives?
It's been their name since 1930, why change it now?
Sent from my HTC One X
Moved to Montana, gonna be a dental floss tycoon.
Let me ask you this if the name of the team was the New Jersey N****rs do you think they should be forced to change it.
Carry on.
10 Congressmen published an open letter calling for Snyder to change it, which started the latest hoo-haw.
Which Carolina?
I take it you think so. Maybe you should take it up with Goldie?
I take it that these congressmen had complaints from their constituency? Frankly, I really don't care what they call themselves. I don't recollect ever having heard any Native American complain about the name just like had never heard any native American complain about North Dakota's hockey team either.
Not my fight. Maybe they should call themselves the Washington Fillibusters.
Sent from my HTC One X
Moved to Montana, gonna be a dental floss tycoon.
I have no dog in this fight. Just interested in another thread that could go over 6 posts.
http://mascotcontroversy.weebly.com/case-study-washington-redskins-vs-native-american-activists.html
I don't see how that is relevant. They changed it from Indians and yes since 1972 I have thought the name of the team should be changed. It helps that I am a Giants fan, but still.
I guess my dislike of professional football is showing. I didn't hear it probably because I didn't want to. Thanks though.
Sent from my HTC One X
Moved to Montana, gonna be a dental floss tycoon.
Being as you're a native NYer, I would have thought that the St. John's Red Men would have been high on the list.
Syracuse wasn't immune to insulting native American's either (my family is also SU fans): they had a native american mascot until 1975 (Big Chief Bill Orange).
Re: Redskins... change the name already. It's clearly an offensive slur for native americans.
The Blackhawks are named after a person, Chief Blackhawk of the Sauk tribe. The team does take heat every once in awhile for the Indian face it uses as its logo. No way they'll change it in any of our lifetimes: Best logo in sports.
Yea I see nothing offensive about using an actual tribal name. **** and to a lesser extent Chiefs are slurs. Of all of them though IMO **** is the worst.
Congrats to the Blackhawks on a great game and series win! I think our teams may see each other in the near future!
As to the "Best logo in sports.," it is hard to argue with the 'Hawks or the Redwings. NBA logos generally suck. Baseball doesn't have a ton of long-standing logos per se because most uni's sport a simple script of the mascot or city. Football? Some great ones there with some nice history as well.
In general, newer teams logos and colors are are pretty lame. Either the colors or the logo itself are too trendy. For example, take the Houston Texans; great colors and a stupid, slanted bull caricature.
And to James I say this: If you think sports loyalty is manufactured then you obviously you were not raised in a sports town. While the games themselves are important and a lot of fun, there is a huge amount of civic pride at stake that no jersey manufacturer or marketing exec in Bristol, CT can sway.
Mike
Yellow Avenger approved.
I'm with Comic, it should go -- it's stupid and offensive and completely outdated. No honor to the Native American, reference/eithet/perjorative dates from when the only good Indian was a dead one, and if you haven't heard of the controversy before you've not been listening.
i was going to call you on this the moment you typed it, but figured i'd let reality slap you in the face first
pitt was a good regular season team......and beneficiary of playing a young islander team and a decent but dinged up ottawa team......easy draw
they are not built for playoff hockey.....their D is mediocre at best, and neither goalie is starter quality
the bruins are better in all 3 zones in the playoffs......they cycle and grind in the zone better, they don't turn the puck over, and both their forwards and defensemen can actually play D.....Letang is an offensive defenseman for sure.....but it is a joke that he's a Norris finalist
looking forward to an original 6 finals
I find the willingness to give it up frightening.