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Not a Bernie Bro

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  • LandoLando Posts: 266 Senior Member

    My best friend growing up is a concrete cutter......he drank himself out of school his freshman year. You should see the place he just built............Holy effing mother of log. But hey, I have two master's degrees......does that make me "decent" ?

  • sherbsherb Senior Member Posts: 6,410 Senior Member

    @NZ Indicator said:

    @ShawnC2 said:
    I think Joe is referring to the liberal arts "degrees" that I think Joe is alluding to, such as >basket weaving or art appreciation. Agreed that those are quite, um... limiting, in terms of >future earnings potential.

    Correct. They aren't specialized enough to prepare you for a specific career. A bachelor’s degree in liberal arts might make you a well-rounded person, but it won’t necessarily help you get a decent job which is why I think they are useless.

    That's because you, like most Americans, are a Lockean. You're a practical person in a country built for practical people. The beautiful and useless, to paraphrase Aristotle, has no value to you. These assumptions you have: Do you think they just came out of thin air? Or worse, do you think that you're the only person to have them?

    Nothing new under the sun.

  • fishingcomicfishingcomic Senior Member Posts: 26,545 Senior Member

    @sherb said:
    Exactly. If money were my criteria I'd probably be an electrician. My brother barely graduated high school and he makes bank.

    I would have electricuted myself to death. It takes me an entire day to rebuild a carberator. Some people cannot do blue collar.

    My mother hired a man to put in a cement patio. As I was watching him I came to realize that he probably put as much time into perfecting his craft as anyone with a college education.

    My dad wore a suit and tie to work.

    'I've spoken of the Shining City all my political life. …In my mind it was a tall, proud city built on rocks stronger than oceans, windswept, God-blessed, and teeming with people of all kinds living in harmony and peace; a city with free ports that hummed with commerce and creativity. And if there had to be city walls, the walls had doors and the doors were open to anyone with the will and the heart to get here. That's how I saw it, and see it still.'" Ronald Reagan
  • Buffco2Buffco2 Posts: 861 Senior Member
    edited March 2020 #35

    Nothing gives me more satisfaction than building something. Or repairing something.

    My dad was an electrician in his younger days. Back then it was the office guy who made bank. I've always wondered what would've been different if he had kept doing that.

  • George KGeorge K Super Moderator Posts: 11,659 Senior Member

    Unless you in a technical field, few jobs require specific knowledge from day one. Being a well-rounded person will not get you hired, but being adaptable, knowing how to analyze and think critically will. These are the skills you get from a traditional liberal arts education.

    The GOP big tent now is the size of a pup tent, its floor splattered with guano.
  • ShawnC2ShawnC2 Posts: 1,701 Senior Member

    True, George. I wonder how many people work in fields that differ considerably from what they studied as an undergrad. My wife and I are two of them.

    My wife's degree, psychology (spelled: useless) has led to jobs where a BS/BA was a prerequisite for consideration. So it has worked out for her. Still, she should have attended a lesser/more affordable school where the value equation was more in her favor.

  • MikeAMikeA Senior Member Posts: 6,227 Senior Member
    edited March 2020 #38

    I'd give anything for some folks with just a little skill and alot of motivation. Good grief it's hard to get anybody to do anything these days. I'm in the IT buisness and all they want to do is desk ****.

  • ShawnC2ShawnC2 Posts: 1,701 Senior Member

    Yep. Give me someone who gives a sh** over someone with knowledge but a bad and/or lazy attitude.

  • ShawnC2ShawnC2 Posts: 1,701 Senior Member

    We both get GOML points for this!

  • George KGeorge K Super Moderator Posts: 11,659 Senior Member

    @ShawnC2 said:

    .

    My wife's degree, psychology (spelled: useless) has led to jobs where a BS/BA was a prerequisite for consideration.

    My formal post high school education has been in history, poli-sci and economics. It led to jobs in marketing/merchandising for two major department stores, working in a fly shop, and writing civil service exams; most of them job simulations or video-based. the Foreign Service was the only one that had anything to do with what I studied.

    I was somewhat surprised to learn that when devising civil service exams I was officially working in the field of psychology, specifically "psycho-metrics".

    The GOP big tent now is the size of a pup tent, its floor splattered with guano.
  • fishingcomicfishingcomic Senior Member Posts: 26,545 Senior Member
    edited March 2020 #42

    Here is one of his points about to play out. There are restaurant workers and hospitality workers that are suffering. But again we are going to bail out the shale oil companies.

    Instead of sending the stimulus to the corporations why not help the consumers and employees?

    'I've spoken of the Shining City all my political life. …In my mind it was a tall, proud city built on rocks stronger than oceans, windswept, God-blessed, and teeming with people of all kinds living in harmony and peace; a city with free ports that hummed with commerce and creativity. And if there had to be city walls, the walls had doors and the doors were open to anyone with the will and the heart to get here. That's how I saw it, and see it still.'" Ronald Reagan
  • NZ IndicatorNZ Indicator Senior Member Posts: 12,226 Senior Member

    @Lando said:
    What is a "decent" job to you?

    One that has decent pay and benefits.

  • NZ IndicatorNZ Indicator Senior Member Posts: 12,226 Senior Member

    @Buffco2 said:
    More money.
    To him.

    Well yeah!!! The reason I went to college.

  • NZ IndicatorNZ Indicator Senior Member Posts: 12,226 Senior Member

    @Lando said:
    Oh, well you don't need a degree to make money.

    Agree. I know a few guys with high school diplomas making some good money as general managers of a few local companies. And of course there are exceptions such as Zuckerberg, Gates, Dell etc. But those are exceptions. Not the rule.

    But statistically the chances to make more money are better when you do have one.

    https://www.educationcorner.com/benefit-of-earning-a-college-degree.html

    https://www.usatoday.com/story/money/2017/01/12/pay-gap-between-college-grads-and-everyone-else-record/96493348/

  • NZ IndicatorNZ Indicator Senior Member Posts: 12,226 Senior Member
    edited March 2020 #46

    @Buffco2 said:
    Nothing gives me more satisfaction than building something. Or repairing something.

    Same here. I like building and repairing things. I have some building projects planned around the house this summer.

    I have a 3d printer at work and it's kinda cool to watch my designs become reality. I get some satisfaction from that.

  • MikeAMikeA Senior Member Posts: 6,227 Senior Member
    edited March 2020 #47

    @Buffco2 said:
    Nothing gives me more satisfaction than building something. Or repairing something.
    My dad was an electrician in his younger days. Back then it was the office guy who made bank. I've always wondered what would've been different if he had kept doing that.

    I repaired/replaced the drain pump our Samsung front loader cloths washer last night. It had been making some crazy noise then it finally failed last Thursday. I made that repair with a pump from amazon for $25. My wife was so happy. Let's just say I got some satisfaction from that repair...

  • LandoLando Posts: 266 Senior Member

    @NZ Indicator said:

    @Lando said:
    Oh, well you don't need a degree to make money.

    Agree. I know a few guys with high school diplomas making some good money as general managers of a few local companies. And of course there are exceptions such as Zuckerberg, Gates, Dell etc. But those are exceptions. Not the rule.

    But statistically the chances to make more money are better when you do have one.

    https://www.educationcorner.com/benefit-of-earning-a-college-degree.html

    https://www.usatoday.com/story/money/2017/01/12/pay-gap-between-college-grads-and-everyone-else-record/96493348/

    I think you are preaching to the choir here.....I just want kids to actually have an idea of what they are getting into, so college isn't for everyone. If you don't care about school in high school, it won't change in college.

    I just shared this yesterday.....

    https://study.com/articles/How_Much_More_Do_College_Graduates_Earn_Than_Non-College_Graduates.html

    And I am a huge propionate of Soft Skills over Hard skills. Give me a kid that is motivated, can communicate, takes accountability, can think for themselves, is punctual has respect, and patience over a 4.0 college grad any day of the week.

  • NZ IndicatorNZ Indicator Senior Member Posts: 12,226 Senior Member
    edited March 2020 #49

    @Lando said:
    If you don't care about school in high school, it won't change in college.

    I'm not sure that's totally true. I was one of the ones that didn't care in high school.

    I came out of high school with a GPA of around 2.0. With the exception that I excelled at all of the math, algebra, geometry and physics classes. The other classes brought me down.

    College I came out with a 3.8 gpa. Because I cared and knew it affected my future....I applied myself a little better than I did in high school.

    Also saw a few of my classmates over the years at high school reunions and what not...They did worse than I did in high school but excelled in college and are now teachers, banker, financial advisors etc.

    I guess you and I differ that way. I find a person with hard skills more useful and those types seem to have a few more street smarts as well.

  • GreenMtBoy2GreenMtBoy2 Posts: 693 Senior Member

    I have a bachelors degree in History and a law degree (Juris Doctor). Doing just fine.

  • LandoLando Posts: 266 Senior Member

    @NZ Indicator said:

    I guess you and I differ that way. I find a person with hard skills more useful and those types seem to have a few more street smarts as well.

    I think we differ in a lot of ways...........but I will just say that you may think you know more about this than I.

  • GreenMtBoy2GreenMtBoy2 Posts: 693 Senior Member
    edited March 2020 #53

    What I have seen is people with a liberal arts degree who go to law school just because they're not ready/able to go into the work world and then either flame out after being in law school for awhile or come out of law school but don't want to be a lawyer. Sometimes the law degree will be useful in other work contexts but more often than not it seems like a waste of money or time. Stated differently: don't go to law school unless you actually want to practice law.

  • breamfisherbreamfisher Senior Member Posts: 6,287 Senior Member

    One degree I don't recommend is one in fisheries, at least not if you want to work for a state agency. Not even a Master's. It's more lucrative to teach.

  • jbillyjbilly Senior Member Posts: 6,014 Senior Member

    $100k later...

  • NZ IndicatorNZ Indicator Senior Member Posts: 12,226 Senior Member

    @Lando said:

    @NZ Indicator said:
    ...but I will just say that you may think you know more about this than I.

    Wow. Sounds a little conceited...

  • LandoLando Posts: 266 Senior Member
  • CO NativeCO Native Senior Member Posts: 2,299 Senior Member

    Every person is going to be different. My oldest brother had two doctorates, started and sold several companies and could read a MS Window's manual and recite it to you.
    He couldn't grease the bearings on his boat trailer. His mind didn't work that way. He could NOT fix ANYTHING!!! (luckily he had so much money he didn't need to).

    Me and my other two brothers can fix anything and can figure out how things work. We didn't go to college and we all made out just fine because we each found what we were good at and took that path.

    So some kids need that education to survive and for others it's a huge waste of money. Having the common sense to know which is right for you is what's missing in today's youth.

  • creekguycreekguy Senior Member Posts: 4,363 Senior Member

    You know, college is just one way of showing potential employers that you can and are willing to do what used to be called "pushing a pencil". Its like showing up for your interview in a jacket and tie as a sign of your surrender to the "system".

  • jbillyjbilly Senior Member Posts: 6,014 Senior Member

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