The art of the deal.

fishingcomicfishingcomic Senior MemberPosts: 21,721 Senior Member
'I've spoken of the Shining City all my political life. …In my mind it was a tall, proud city built on rocks stronger than oceans, windswept, God-blessed, and teeming with people of all kinds living in harmony and peace; a city with free ports that hummed with commerce and creativity. And if there had to be city walls, the walls had doors and the doors were open to anyone with the will and the heart to get here. That's how I saw it, and see it still.'" Ronald Reagan

Replies

  • GoldenladleGoldenladle Super Moderator Posts: 3,787 Senior Member
    edited July 31 #2

    Will he believe the intelligence info?

    Moved to Montana, gonna be a dental floss tycoon.

  • MikeAMikeA Senior Member Posts: 2,820 Senior Member
    edited July 31 #3

    So if this is the case, you guys are ready to bomb them now, right? Or do you prefer the 8 year Obama do nothing tactic while NK perfected the ICBM?

  • fishingcomicfishingcomic Senior Member Posts: 21,721 Senior Member

    Aren't we currently doing the do nothing tactic? The difference is Obama never heaped praises on Kim Jung Un nor did he unilaterally end all joint exercises or lift sanctions.

    'I've spoken of the Shining City all my political life. …In my mind it was a tall, proud city built on rocks stronger than oceans, windswept, God-blessed, and teeming with people of all kinds living in harmony and peace; a city with free ports that hummed with commerce and creativity. And if there had to be city walls, the walls had doors and the doors were open to anyone with the will and the heart to get here. That's how I saw it, and see it still.'" Ronald Reagan
  • GoldenladleGoldenladle Super Moderator Posts: 3,787 Senior Member

    @MikeA said:
    So if this is the case, you guys are ready to bomb them now, right?

    No, poor assumption.

    Moved to Montana, gonna be a dental floss tycoon.

  • MikeAMikeA Senior Member Posts: 2,820 Senior Member
    edited July 31 #6

    If the talks fail, at least we can say we seriously tried diplomacy.

  • GoldenladleGoldenladle Super Moderator Posts: 3,787 Senior Member
    edited July 31 #8

    I think you have define the Trump diplomacy. He gave away the annual war games for nothing. I’m not so sure I would call it diplomacy. Appease the dictator maybe.

    Moved to Montana, gonna be a dental floss tycoon.

  • NZ IndicatorNZ Indicator Senior Member Posts: 9,288 Senior Member

    @Goldenladle said:
    I think you have define the Trump diplomacy. He gave away the annual war games for nothing. I’m not so sure I would call it diplomacy. Appease the dictator maybe.

    The problem is that you are dealing with a country that has no morals, no ethics, no history of ever complying with an international agreement.

    All we are doing is showing the rest of the world how stupid our presidents, ambassadors and diplomats have been for the past two decades.

  • GoldenladleGoldenladle Super Moderator Posts: 3,787 Senior Member
    edited July 31 #10

    I don’t believe any of the past presidents have given anything away, only Trump has. Not sure how that makes him better.

    Moved to Montana, gonna be a dental floss tycoon.

  • creekyguycreekyguy Posts: 145 Senior Member

    The unfortunate fact is that the best strategy sometime is patience with some sanctions. Once again we have critics of past strategy skirting around the hard choices of the past: Patience or WAR. We tried war in Iraq, and the critics of NKorea and Iran policy might want to explain how war with those countries is a good idea.

  • NZ IndicatorNZ Indicator Senior Member Posts: 9,288 Senior Member
    edited July 31 #12

    @Goldenladle said:
    I don’t believe any of the past presidents have given anything away, only Trump has. Not sure how that makes him better.

    I'm not saying he's better. But dealings with NK have been nothing more than same-same no matter who was president. This WaPost article is really just nothing but a partisan piece of propaganda .

    http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/opinion/oped/bs-ed-op-0310-thomas-kim-20180308-story.html#

  • Shawn C.Shawn C. Senior Member Posts: 5,616 Senior Member

    @NZ Indicator said:

    The problem is that NK is dealing with an administration that has no morals, no ethics, no history of ever complying with an international agreement.

    All we are doing is showing the rest of the world how stupid our current president, ambassadors and diplomats are.

    Fixed it a bit for ya.

  • fishingcomicfishingcomic Senior Member Posts: 21,721 Senior Member

    @MikeA said:
    If the talks fail, at least we can say we seriously tried diplomacy.

    They already failed.

    'I've spoken of the Shining City all my political life. …In my mind it was a tall, proud city built on rocks stronger than oceans, windswept, God-blessed, and teeming with people of all kinds living in harmony and peace; a city with free ports that hummed with commerce and creativity. And if there had to be city walls, the walls had doors and the doors were open to anyone with the will and the heart to get here. That's how I saw it, and see it still.'" Ronald Reagan
  • fishingcomicfishingcomic Senior Member Posts: 21,721 Senior Member

    @NZ Indicator said:

    @Goldenladle said:
    I think you have define the Trump diplomacy. He gave away the annual war games for nothing. I’m not so sure I would call it diplomacy. Appease the dictator maybe.

    The problem is that you are dealing with a country that has no morals, no ethics, no history of ever complying with an international agreement.

    Wow this almost sounds like Trump.

    'I've spoken of the Shining City all my political life. …In my mind it was a tall, proud city built on rocks stronger than oceans, windswept, God-blessed, and teeming with people of all kinds living in harmony and peace; a city with free ports that hummed with commerce and creativity. And if there had to be city walls, the walls had doors and the doors were open to anyone with the will and the heart to get here. That's how I saw it, and see it still.'" Ronald Reagan
  • NZ IndicatorNZ Indicator Senior Member Posts: 9,288 Senior Member

    @fishingcomic said:

    @NZ Indicator said:

    @Goldenladle said:
    I think you have define the Trump diplomacy. He gave away the annual war games for nothing. I’m not so sure I would call it diplomacy. Appease the dictator maybe.

    The problem is that you are dealing with a country that has no morals, no ethics, no history of ever complying with an international agreement.

    Wow this almost sounds like Trump.

    No. It's just the fact of the matter. To believe otherwise would be silly.

  • MikeAMikeA Senior Member Posts: 2,820 Senior Member
    edited August 1 #17

    This is how Diplomacy works. Like it or not. Partisan politics aside, this was pretty awesome.

    OSAN AIR BASE, South Korea – Remains handed over by North Korea to the United States last week were confirmed to be human and are likely to be American soldiers, officials said on Wednesday.

    https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world/2018/08/01/presumed-us-korean-war-remains-south-korea/877817002/

  • GoldenladleGoldenladle Super Moderator Posts: 3,787 Senior Member

    Well, all I can say is Joe and Mike, you guys can go on thinking that what you're watching is some sort of diplomatic epiphany, the rest of us will watch the relationship with North Korea without the stars in our eyes.

    Moved to Montana, gonna be a dental floss tycoon.

  • MikeAMikeA Senior Member Posts: 2,820 Senior Member

    What relationship with NK? We don't have one yet. That they are returning the remains of our war dead is pure PR. So what. That doesn't negate the significance of it to the families of the dead, or the men who fought beside them.

  • NZ IndicatorNZ Indicator Senior Member Posts: 9,288 Senior Member
    edited August 1 #20

    @Goldenladle said:
    Well, all I can say is Joe and Mike, you guys can go on thinking that what you're watching is some sort of diplomatic epiphany...

    Huh? Where do you get this? You reading something different than what I am writing?

    I've already stated that our attempts at a relationship/agreement with NK is a failure which includes the current president and past presidents.

    As I stated earlier...The problem is that you are dealing with a country that has no morals, no ethics, no history of ever complying with an international agreement.

    The story FC linked is nothing more than a repeat of what has happened with past presidents that have tried the same and failed.

  • fishingcomicfishingcomic Senior Member Posts: 21,721 Senior Member

    @NZ Indicator said:

    @fishingcomic said:

    @NZ Indicator said:

    @Goldenladle said:
    I think you have define the Trump diplomacy. He gave away the annual war games for nothing. I’m not so sure I would call it diplomacy. Appease the dictator maybe.

    The problem is that you are dealing with a country that has no morals, no ethics, no history of ever complying with an international agreement.

    Wow this almost sounds like Trump.

    No. It's just the fact of the matter. To believe otherwise would be silly.

    It would be silly to think any different about Trump.

    'I've spoken of the Shining City all my political life. …In my mind it was a tall, proud city built on rocks stronger than oceans, windswept, God-blessed, and teeming with people of all kinds living in harmony and peace; a city with free ports that hummed with commerce and creativity. And if there had to be city walls, the walls had doors and the doors were open to anyone with the will and the heart to get here. That's how I saw it, and see it still.'" Ronald Reagan
  • fishingcomicfishingcomic Senior Member Posts: 21,721 Senior Member

    @MikeA said:
    What relationship with NK? We don't have one

    Exactly. We just gave them everything they have wanted for 50 years and got nothing in return. While you guys are declaring this the deal of the century. There is no deal!!!

    'I've spoken of the Shining City all my political life. …In my mind it was a tall, proud city built on rocks stronger than oceans, windswept, God-blessed, and teeming with people of all kinds living in harmony and peace; a city with free ports that hummed with commerce and creativity. And if there had to be city walls, the walls had doors and the doors were open to anyone with the will and the heart to get here. That's how I saw it, and see it still.'" Ronald Reagan
  • fishingcomicfishingcomic Senior Member Posts: 21,721 Senior Member

    @NZ Indicator said:

    @Goldenladle said:
    Well, all I can say is Joe and Mike, you guys can go on thinking that what you're watching is some sort of diplomatic epiphany...

    Huh? Where do you get this? You reading something different than what I am writing?

    I've already stated that our attempts at a relationship/agreement with NK is a failure which includes the current president and past presidents.

    As I stated earlier...The problem is that you are dealing with a country that has no morals, no ethics, no history of ever complying with an international agreement.

    The story FC linked is nothing more than a repeat of what has happened with past presidents that have tried the same and failed.

    None of the others took a victory lap around the country on a deal they did not get.

    'I've spoken of the Shining City all my political life. …In my mind it was a tall, proud city built on rocks stronger than oceans, windswept, God-blessed, and teeming with people of all kinds living in harmony and peace; a city with free ports that hummed with commerce and creativity. And if there had to be city walls, the walls had doors and the doors were open to anyone with the will and the heart to get here. That's how I saw it, and see it still.'" Ronald Reagan
  • GoldenladleGoldenladle Super Moderator Posts: 3,787 Senior Member

    @NZ Indicator said:

    @Goldenladle said:

    All we are doing is showing the rest of the world how stupid our presidents, ambassadors and diplomats have been for the past two decades.

    Joe, this is how interpreted what you wrote. There is no mention of our current president in your criticism of the past efforts at diplomacy. Read as is it seems that you think Trump seems to have achieved something special. He hasn't. Getting the remains is great, it offers closure to those families, but not much else for this country. I'm pretty certain there are remains of our military personal in Viet Nam as well, where is the effort in getting them back?

    Moved to Montana, gonna be a dental floss tycoon.

  • NZ IndicatorNZ Indicator Senior Member Posts: 9,288 Senior Member

    @Goldenladle said:

    @NZ Indicator said:

    @Goldenladle said:

    All we are doing is showing the rest of the world how stupid our presidents, ambassadors and diplomats have been for the past two decades.

    Joe, this is how interpreted what you wrote. There is no mention of our current president in your criticism of the past efforts at diplomacy. Read as is it seems that you think Trump seems to have achieved something special. He hasn't. Getting the remains is great, it offers closure to those families, but not much else for this country. I'm pretty certain there are remains of our military personal in Viet Nam as well, where is the effort in getting them back?

    You interpreted incorrectly sir.

    Go back and read post #9 where I said "our presidents" which means that includes the current one.

  • creekyguycreekyguy Posts: 145 Senior Member

    There is no ID of the NK remains yet. They could be any nationality. So far, one (1) dog tag has been returned. No mention of how it was recovered or who it was. Overall, its a big nothing.

  • George KGeorge K Super Moderator Posts: 8,827 Senior Member
    Keep your stinkin' government hands off my Medicare.

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