No discussion of the school shooting in Florida?

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Replies

  • BushartBushart Senior Member Posts: 1,793 Senior Member
    I'm in the camp that calling this guy down in public is wrong---and just as I was trying to see Trump in another light---as the most un-likely Pres to get anywhere on this file

    This guy's conscience is gotta be killing him---maybe the training or selection process for that position is flawed

    I agree none of us know how we would react?---I've never been in a gun fight

    Been confronted by wild animals who like to eat people is all

    Anyway I recall a story my old boss told me years ago---He was shipboard heading to Europe in ww2---he recalled some guys were gonna be heroes and kick some real ****
    He said when they hit battle---they were the 1st crying in their foxholes

    So yup nobody knows which way you turn when it hits the fan
  • BushartBushart Senior Member Posts: 1,793 Senior Member
    So apparently I've been accused of blaming the nra

    Well get in line boys....

    http://www.cbc.ca/news/business/nra-guns-shootings-1.4548756
  • sherbsherb Senior Member Posts: 2,369 Senior Member
  • sherbsherb Senior Member Posts: 2,369 Senior Member
    Bushart wrote: »
    So apparently I've been accused of blaming the nra

    Well get in line boys....

    http://www.cbc.ca/news/business/nra-guns-shootings-1.4548756

    It only looks that way. In reality, crises like this tend to ramp up both NRA memberships and Gun and ammo sales. For every backlash against the NRA, there's a backlash against the backlash.

    You know who doesn't want new gun legislation? Democrats. It will jeopardize their chances of retaking the house.
  • breamfisherbreamfisher Senior Member Posts: 4,322 Senior Member
    sherb wrote: »
    Uh... that's kinda what I was saying (or at least what I meant) with my "binary solutions" post.
  • BushartBushart Senior Member Posts: 1,793 Senior Member
    sherb wrote: »
    It only looks that way. In reality, crises like this tend to ramp up both NRA memberships and Gun and ammo sales. For every backlash against the NRA, there's a backlash against the backlash.

    You know who doesn't want new gun legislation? Democrats. It will jeopardize their chances of retaking the house.

    Likely

    It is currently the battle charge into mid-terms
  • sherbsherb Senior Member Posts: 2,369 Senior Member
    Uh... that's kinda what I was saying (or at least what I meant) with my "binary solutions" post.

    Yeah, and I agree. I just thought the way he put it was particularly apt.
  • breamfisherbreamfisher Senior Member Posts: 4,322 Senior Member
    True.

    =====
  • jbillyjbilly Senior Member Posts: 4,792 Senior Member
    sherb wrote: »
    Yeah, and I agree. I just thought the way he put it was particularly apt.

    I think as part of the solution the problem should be fully realized before trying to fix it.

    The simple problem is "kids are getting killed in schools by guns"

    But as pointed out before its lazy. I fully acknowledge that its happening and happening with guns. Got it. Check. But the problem is a lot deeper than that.

    "**** up kids are killing kids with guns in schools"

    The elephant in the room is that no sane person would ever do this. We can talk about how bad guns are all we want, but if we think that is the root of the problem and the only fix we will solve nothing. Sane people don't shoot up elementary schools, colleges, or now high schools. Sane people don't shoot up night clubs or Christmas parties. Did they do it with guns, yes. Can they do it with other stuff, you bet.

    Sure, lets have the gun debate but dear god while it facilitates the commission of the heinous act it sure as hell isn't the root cause.
  • WetdogWetdog Senior Member Posts: 5,149 Senior Member
    Does anyone on this thread besides sherb that knows the difference between an AR 15 and other long guns...Bream I expect knows.
    I find the assault on free thought disturbing,
    I find the willingness to give it up frightening.
  • breamfisherbreamfisher Senior Member Posts: 4,322 Senior Member
    PM inbound.
  • George KGeorge K Super Moderator Posts: 8,947 Senior Member
    I know full well, having owned an AR 15 Commando (selector switch, short barrel, folding wire stock) back in Viet Nam in 1967, which I got by trading cases of Cs and a few $$$, to carry instead of my Army-issued M14 (I was in the artillery). I got away with that by promising to sell it to the officer I reported to upon rotation. Cases of Cs were the universal trading currency when I was there in 1966-67. My battalion's supply battery capt. obtained jeeps, many skids of Cs and bokoo (GI spelling) lumber stolen from other units that had not yet arrived in country, using forged papers and trucks with false unit IDs painted on the bumpers. Our colonel at Long Binh had a hooch three times his authorized size.

    These days our rifle collection consists of a Ruger .22 I bought in 1976 and my wife's octagonal barrel pump .22 inherited from her father. The well-scoped Ruger is all I need to control the ground hog population on our property.
    Keep your stinkin' government hands off my Medicare.
  • Shawn C.Shawn C. Senior Member Posts: 5,733 Senior Member
    George K wrote: »
    The well-scoped Ruger is all I need to control the ground hog population on our property.

    How many weeks of winter are left when Punxsutawny Phil sees his life flash before his eyes?
  • sherbsherb Senior Member Posts: 2,369 Senior Member
    Shawn C. wrote: »
    How many weeks of winter are left when Punxsutawny Phil sees his life flash before his eyes?

    Western PA in a nutshell:
  • magallowaymagalloway Senior Member Posts: 900 Senior Member
    Carried a M16A1 '68-69 and detested the sucker. The stuff on the market these days is even butt-uglier; if you MUST carry a thing-killer, at least carry one with a little style.

    Jim
  • fishingcomicfishingcomic Senior Member Posts: 21,887 Senior Member
    Poor parenting and family breakdown. It's a societal problem.

    Recognition of where the need for violence was conceived and nurtured needs to be talked about first.

    Poor parenting? Like letting your son own an AR-15?
    'I've spoken of the Shining City all my political life. …In my mind it was a tall, proud city built on rocks stronger than oceans, windswept, God-blessed, and teeming with people of all kinds living in harmony and peace; a city with free ports that hummed with commerce and creativity. And if there had to be city walls, the walls had doors and the doors were open to anyone with the will and the heart to get here. That's how I saw it, and see it still.'" Ronald Reagan
  • fishingcomicfishingcomic Senior Member Posts: 21,887 Senior Member
    sherb wrote: »
    It only looks that way. In reality, crises like this tend to ramp up both NRA memberships and Gun and ammo sales. For every backlash against the NRA, there's a backlash against the backlash.

    You know who doesn't want new gun legislation? Democrats. It will jeopardize their chances of retaking the house.

    How much you want to bet it will not be Democrats that will kill any likely bill?
    'I've spoken of the Shining City all my political life. …In my mind it was a tall, proud city built on rocks stronger than oceans, windswept, God-blessed, and teeming with people of all kinds living in harmony and peace; a city with free ports that hummed with commerce and creativity. And if there had to be city walls, the walls had doors and the doors were open to anyone with the will and the heart to get here. That's how I saw it, and see it still.'" Ronald Reagan
  • EdBEdB Senior Member Posts: 2,848 Senior Member
    Has this aspect of the sad story been discussed?

    http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/48853.htm

    U.S. Military Trained Florida School Shooter to Be “A Very Good Shot”

    By Amy Goodman

    The Florida gunman, a 19-year-old white former student named Nikolas Cruz, was a member of the Army Junior Reserve Officer Training Corps program before he was expelled from the school. Cruz was also part of a four-person JROTC marksmanship team at the school which had received $10,000 in funding from the NRA. For more, we speak with Pat Elder, director of the National Coalition to Protect Student Privacy, an organization that confronts militarism in schools. He’s the author of “Military Recruiting in the United States.”

    AMY GOODMAN: So, you have Nikolas Cruz, the confessed gunman. He’s part of the ROTC program, supported by the NRA, at this school, even as the school has these complaints of harassment and abuse, and ultimately expel him. Can you—he’s wearing a JROTC T-shirt when he opens fire on his classmates.

    PAT ELDER: Well, apparently he wanted to convey to the world that he was affiliated with the JROTC program. Amy, it’s an insidious practice. We have the United States Army and the other three branches in the high schools putting lethal weapons into the hands of 13- and 14-year-olds.
  • breamfisherbreamfisher Senior Member Posts: 4,322 Senior Member
    So now Coral Springs PD officers are reporting that when they rolled up, an additional 3 Broward County Sheriff's Deputies were in a position of cover behind their squad cars.

    Sherb, I think you're right not to trust the Sheriff.

    Sent from my SM-S907VL using Tapatalk
  • sherbsherb Senior Member Posts: 2,369 Senior Member
    And there's more. the call detail logs on the SO's contacts with the shooter are very damning.

    Lets assume the Sheriff is right, that his SRO acted dishonorably. Let's further assume that he will follow suit by throwing these other three to the wolves. Isn't it time for HIM to act honorably, and resign?

    **** rolls downhill, always has. But leadership begins at the top.
  • sherbsherb Senior Member Posts: 2,369 Senior Member
    How much you want to bet it will not be Democrats that will kill any likely bill?

    No, of course not. But they will be thanking God when the GOP kills it, all the while loudly denouncing it. This is trouble they don't need, especially when they have a massive 18 point generic lead at this point.
  • sherbsherb Senior Member Posts: 2,369 Senior Member
    Unfortunately, as much as I don't want to say this, I have to say it. I don't like this sheriff, but I am going to give him his due right now.

    law enforcement deals with so much white noise. So many threats that don't pan out, so many "he's gonna kill me" that never amount to anything. It can be so, so difficult to ferret out the legitimate crazies from the loudmouths and the drama queens. And everyone knows it. . .right up to the minute the bomb goes off. Then in hindsight its all crystal-clear. But its never clear as its happening.
  • BufordBuford Senior Member Posts: 2,878 Senior Member
    Poor parenting? Like letting your son own an AR-15?

    Mine had a Mini-14 before an AR-15. The difference is?
    Just look at the flowers Lizzie just look at the flowers.
  • saltydancindavesaltydancindave Senior Member Posts: 2,402 Senior Member
    sherb wrote: »
    And there's more. the call detail logs on the SO's contacts with the shooter are very damning.

    Lets assume the Sheriff is right, that his SRO acted dishonorably. Let's further assume that he will follow suit by throwing these other three to the wolves. Isn't it time for HIM to act honorably, and resign?
    **** rolls downhill, always has. But leadership begins at the top.

    Florida certainly has those trained to act dishonorably & get paid for it long before this school shooting going back to Arab terrorists that threatened POTUS, which seemingly were getting pilots training from a business that's German owned prior to 9/11.
  • sherbsherb Senior Member Posts: 2,369 Senior Member
    sherb wrote: »
    No, of course not. But they will be thanking God when the GOP kills it, all the while loudly denouncing it. This is trouble they don't need, especially when they have a massive 18 point generic lead at this point.

    Of interest

    https://www.nytimes.com/2018/02/24/us/politics/nra-gun-control-florida.html#click=https://t.co/BUjCRS0qHY
  • BushartBushart Senior Member Posts: 1,793 Senior Member
    Curious as to why then Rubio did not just tell the kid that he does not accept direct NRA contributions?? as per the article claims
  • sherbsherb Senior Member Posts: 2,369 Senior Member
    So now Coral Springs PD officers are reporting that when they rolled up, an additional 3 Broward County Sheriff's Deputies were in a position of cover behind their squad cars.

    Sherb, I think you're right not to trust the Sheriff.

    Apparently the Coral Springs cops are super-pissed.

    I think this Sheriff is in big trouble. I can see one cop freezing. Maybe (unlikely, but maybe) two. But four? No. freaking. way.

    Someone told them to hold in place.
  • breamfisherbreamfisher Senior Member Posts: 4,322 Senior Member
    A Broward SO did enter with the Coral Springs cops, but... yeah.

    The high sheriff should step down, if nothing other than poor leadership. But it seems his officers were told to hold in place. If he made the call, it's a bad call. If it was someone else in his department, then he's not running a good department. I'm not a cop, but from what I've read the national standard is to enter on arrival at something like this.
  • breamfisherbreamfisher Senior Member Posts: 4,322 Senior Member
    https://www.cnn.com/2018/02/23/politics/parkland-school-shooting-broward-deputies/index.html

    Evidently Coral Springs PD reported this to the city manager on Feb. 15.

    Sent from my SM-S907VL using Tapatalk

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