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U.S. is an Oligarchy...

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Replies

  • HextallHextall Senior Member Posts: 9,520 Senior Member
    EdB wrote: »
    could they be acting that way because this system gives them the opportunity to act that way (money/power)?

    Sure some people. But there are plenty of people who are just **** regardless of the political/economical system that they currently occupy. These people are also ****.
  • EdBEdB Senior Member Posts: 3,099 Senior Member
    Hextall wrote: »
    Who asked the question that caused you to start this thread? Was it sherb? Sherb's dead baby. Sherb's dead.

    pulpfiction00001.png

    Nobody asked a question to start this thread, they started asking after it started.
  • JulietJuliet Posts: 49,774 Senior Member
    Potatoes O'Brien with Italian seasonings.

    I'll be right over.
  • NZ IndicatorNZ Indicator Senior Member Posts: 12,285 Senior Member
    EdB wrote: »
    I like when you guys troll me, it gives me a chance to get the message out there and I can strengthen my position.

    Who exactly are you trying to get the message out to considering nobody here takes you seriously?
  • NZ IndicatorNZ Indicator Senior Member Posts: 12,285 Senior Member
    Hextall wrote: »
    Ed for some reason thinks **** will stop being **** if we just say "here ****, here's everything you've ever wanted" not realizing that **** often want other people to not have stuff.

    Calling all the **** in the room...
  • fishingcomicfishingcomic Senior Member Posts: 26,564 Senior Member
    EdB wrote: »
    The reason they've heard it plenty is because they keep asking questions about it and I answer them.

    Have you noticed that none of your answers are convincing?
    'I've spoken of the Shining City all my political life. …In my mind it was a tall, proud city built on rocks stronger than oceans, windswept, God-blessed, and teeming with people of all kinds living in harmony and peace; a city with free ports that hummed with commerce and creativity. And if there had to be city walls, the walls had doors and the doors were open to anyone with the will and the heart to get here. That's how I saw it, and see it still.'" Ronald Reagan
  • HextallHextall Senior Member Posts: 9,520 Senior Member
    Ed, do you think technocracy will actually be implemented in the US? Or do you think that the hurdle of greed is too insurmountable to overcome?
  • creekguycreekguy Senior Member Posts: 4,373 Senior Member
    OK, I'll bite. Ed, in China, the Communist party runs things. There are 87 million members, primarily technocrats and other successful people who are selected democratically by committees of the membership. Of course, corruption is endemic in this group, and they pay only lip service to any thought of communist ideology. How is this different from your version of government?
  • HextallHextall Senior Member Posts: 9,520 Senior Member
    creekguy wrote: »
    How is this different from your version of government?

    I'm not Ed, but I think he'd answer that those people aren't out for the common good. Once anyone starts putting their own personal benefits above the collective, it becomes a corrupt and broken system. Ed thinks that if we do away with money and give everyone everything that they want as long as they are a productive member of this new society, then all individual and collective troubles will go away.

    What I don't get is why he can't realize that people are generally selfish and looking out for ourselves will virtually always trump looking out for the collective. He talks about unlimited resources as if that's true... there isn't nor will their ever be enough Ferraris to satisfy our wants.
  • jbillyjbilly Senior Member Posts: 6,023 Senior Member
    Have you noticed that none of your answers are convincing?

    Don't be so certain, maybe a side of potatoes is what he needed all along to get things ramped up.

    Did you cook them over thermite?

    Did you buy them with energy credits?
  • jbillyjbilly Senior Member Posts: 6,023 Senior Member
    Joe K. wrote: »
    Calling all the **** in the room...

    well I am definitely not alone. :D
  • EdBEdB Senior Member Posts: 3,099 Senior Member
    Hextall wrote: »
    I'm not Ed, but I think he'd answer that those people aren't out for the common good. Once anyone starts putting their own personal benefits above the collective, it becomes a corrupt and broken system. Ed thinks that if we do away with money and give everyone everything that they want as long as they are a productive member of this new society, then all individual and collective troubles will go away.

    What I don't get is why he can't realize that people are generally selfish and looking out for ourselves will virtually always trump looking out for the collective. He talks about unlimited resources as if that's true... there isn't nor will their ever be enough Ferraris to satisfy our wants.

    I disagree that people are generally selfish, they've been conditioned to be selfish by the rules of the money system which they've known since birth. Children raised in a society in which their basic needs are provided as a right of citizenship would be generally unselfish and willing to contribute to the well being of all. I agree that today's adults would find it difficult to accept but their children wouldn't in an energy based society.

    Technology exists to make a better car than a Ferrari (one that drives itself or flies) and everyone would have the use of one.
  • HextallHextall Senior Member Posts: 9,520 Senior Member
    EdB wrote: »
    Technology exists to make a better car than a Ferrari (one that drives itself or flies) and everyone would have the use of one.

    "Better" is subjective. To many people, there is significant value in the joy associated with driving a car, especially a highly engineered one such as a Ferrari. Are only certain joyful things going to be accepted in a technocratic society and who approves what is acceptable?
  • creekguycreekguy Senior Member Posts: 4,373 Senior Member
    EdB wrote: »
    I disagree that people are generally selfish, they've been conditioned to be selfish by the rules of the money system which they've known since birth. Children raised in a society in which their basic needs are provided as a right of citizenship would be generally unselfish and willing to contribute to the well being of all. I agree that today's adults would find it difficult to accept but their children wouldn't in an energy based society.

    Technology exists to make a better car than a Ferrari (one that drives itself or flies) and everyone would have the use of one.

    You know Ed, that pretty much what Mao enforced in China during his life. They were even forced to wear the same drab clothes, and similar homes and food. People were strongly indoctrinated to be egalitarian and reject ego. The result: elitism and bureaucracy wormed their way back into the system to the point that Mao instituted the Cultural Revolution to destroy HIS OWN establishment. And even that didn't work.
  • EdBEdB Senior Member Posts: 3,099 Senior Member
    creekguy wrote: »
    You know Ed, that pretty much what Mao enforced in China during his life. They were even forced to wear the same drab clothes, and similar homes and food. People were strongly indoctrinated to be egalitarian and reject ego. The result: elitism and bureaucracy wormed their way back into the system to the point that Mao instituted the Cultural Revolution to destroy HIS OWN establishment. And even that didn't work.

    Mao operated within the money system where people could be corrupted by money and power over other people. Not so in a scientific energy society.
  • ricinusricinus Senior Member Posts: 6,210 Senior Member
    What about potatoes?

    Mike
    My new goal in life is to become an Alter Kaker...
  • flytrapflytrap Banned Posts: 1,659 Senior Member
    EdB wrote: »
    You've heard this before, when enough people stop voting for politicians because they are disgusted with the corrupt political system, they will look for a different social structure.
    No. they won't. It will just be FEWER voters making the decisions for all of us. And under an system, there will only be a finite supply of, say, oil, iron ore, uranium, corn, whatever.
  • jbillyjbilly Senior Member Posts: 6,023 Senior Member
    ricinus wrote: »
    What about potatoes?

    Mike

    That money system makes a lot more sense than energy credit. Which is more valuable though, a pound of fries or a pound of tater tots?
  • ricinusricinus Senior Member Posts: 6,210 Senior Member
    Depends, Poutine or just ketchup..

    Mike
    My new goal in life is to become an Alter Kaker...
  • flytrapflytrap Banned Posts: 1,659 Senior Member
    EdB wrote: »
    I disagree that people are generally selfish, they've been conditioned to be selfish
    Well, which is it? Either they are or are not, whether by nature or conditioning.
  • jbillyjbilly Senior Member Posts: 6,023 Senior Member
    ricinus wrote: »
    Depends, Poutine or just ketchup..

    Mike

    Holy crap no wonder economics is so **** complex

    [/mind blown]
  • fishingcomicfishingcomic Senior Member Posts: 26,564 Senior Member
    EdB wrote: »
    Mao operated within the money system where people could be corrupted by money and power over other people. Not so in a scientific energy society.

    Energy credits are a form of currency.
    'I've spoken of the Shining City all my political life. …In my mind it was a tall, proud city built on rocks stronger than oceans, windswept, God-blessed, and teeming with people of all kinds living in harmony and peace; a city with free ports that hummed with commerce and creativity. And if there had to be city walls, the walls had doors and the doors were open to anyone with the will and the heart to get here. That's how I saw it, and see it still.'" Ronald Reagan
  • EdBEdB Senior Member Posts: 3,099 Senior Member
    Energy credits are a form of currency.[/QUOTE

    No, they are definitely not a form of currency. But you're not convinced by what I say so we can just leave it there.
  • flytrapflytrap Banned Posts: 1,659 Senior Member
    Gotta ask, if they are a form or exchange, doesn't that make them a currency?
  • EdBEdB Senior Member Posts: 3,099 Senior Member
    flytrap wrote: »
    Gotta ask, if they are a form or exchange, doesn't that make them a currency?

    They are not a form of exchange, they are a scientific measurement of consumption.
  • jbillyjbilly Senior Member Posts: 6,023 Senior Member
    EdB wrote: »
    They are not a form of exchange, they are a scientific measurement of consumption.

    But I get an unlimited supply of them and can exchange them for goods and services still right?
  • Shawn C.Shawn C. Senior Member Posts: 7,027 Senior Member
    I would exchange them all for poutine. ****, now I'm hungry...

    Hex, Awesome Pulp Fiction reference!
  • fishingcomicfishingcomic Senior Member Posts: 26,564 Senior Member
    EdB wrote: »
    They are not a form of exchange, they are a scientific measurement of consumption.

    Are they not exchanged for goods and services?
    'I've spoken of the Shining City all my political life. …In my mind it was a tall, proud city built on rocks stronger than oceans, windswept, God-blessed, and teeming with people of all kinds living in harmony and peace; a city with free ports that hummed with commerce and creativity. And if there had to be city walls, the walls had doors and the doors were open to anyone with the will and the heart to get here. That's how I saw it, and see it still.'" Ronald Reagan
  • EdBEdB Senior Member Posts: 3,099 Senior Member
    Are they not exchanged for goods and services?

    No, they are a record of energy consumed so that consumption can be replaced in inventory. The amount of energy is limited only by the energy available from the sun, which is more than can be consumed by the population in any given time period.
  • jbillyjbilly Senior Member Posts: 6,023 Senior Member
    EdB wrote: »
    No, they are a record of energy consumed so that consumption can be replaced in inventory. The amount of energy is limited only by the energy available from the sun, which is more than can be consumed by the population in any given time period.

    But I thought this replaces currency? If there is no currency what do I use to obtain goods and services which I myself can't produce?

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